Some people may dislike the download page with the delayed download VS direct download (with donation), but is the only way to have the donations minimally working to keep the project alive.
Question is, how you would feel if you read on that page a message like this one?
Elive is not for everybody, only for those who loves it, if you don’t want to wait the delayed download or to donate, we beg you to use windows or ubuntu instead.
I mean, you would feel OK and agree? or you would feel bad like attacked because of his negative point of view?
this message is of course meant to avoid people complaining about the way to download
What is the point here? If I offer any good at Amazon Marketplace or Ebay, but the possible customer don’t like the platform, should I move?
Are the voices against Your choice so loud, that you’ll need to change?
To be honest, I hate the delay, too. If I take the time to start a project, I want to download the package and go on. But It’s your choice to delay the download, and I’ll deal with it. Instead of trying the brand new Elive Linux with all the benefits and new issues and bugs, I have 24h to complain all over the internet, how stupid this is …
I don’t think your purpose is to get rich with Elive. And even when that is your personal goal: Okay. I am using Elive as long as it fulfill my needs.
Last month I’ve got some time and used it for doing some translations in Elive. Even that contribution don’t get me the privilege to get an early download.
I’m sad to see how many discussion is going on, because of some people who want to get a free (not as in free beer) product even freer (as in free beer). I understand the discussion about ‘How to get donations’, that is a different topic.
I think your message is not wrong. In a way it is constructive with a alternate solution. But it also could put Elive Linux to something like an ‘Elite Club’. Only the worthy people can touch the holy grail, the normals has to live under the tent of mainstream …
I really hope nobody read my whole text. It is too much time to say ‘I feel OK, but maybe for a different reason’. I don’t think it avoid the complaining.
nobody forces them to use Elive, if you don't like the delayed-download, which thanks to it, it allows everybody being able to use Elive entirely cost-free, just pick another OS
(remember that previous versions of elive required a donation to install the OS, so waiting is not any limitation even if annoying)
The reason of this thread is that I received yesterday a double feedback from a user very upset about the overall method used, so upset that even included something like this:
I can't even wrap my mind around how mentally deficient you have to be to think this model makes anyone want to donate.
Well, I should not consider this feedback at all since feedbacks like this happens very rarely (if these feedbacks are more common, then there's a problem), and looks more like this person had a bad day lol. Unfortunately he just expressed his opinion and cannot know / understand that this model is actually the one on which donations works minimally (and he didn't leave any valid email so that I can answer him).
To be honest, I don't like it too, and it also decreases the possible amount of new users by 3x times (3x times less downloads)
That could be nice, but the real problem is that I'm forced to do it this way, I have tried the previous days to leave the direct downloads and just having an optional donation suggestion in the installation process, and the result after one week is that the donations are not enough to keep alive the project (that could be different of course if we had 10x times more of users, but only enough to keep the project alive)
Unfortunately there's not a developed integrated feature in the website to do that (and would not be easy to develop this), but a simple trick is to just open back the download email when you want to download again Elive or newer versions, unless the link changed (which happens rarely), will have the download links with updated versions.
Yes, we should clear in fact this forum about all these topics and negative ones, to have a better focused, organized and useful forum for everybody. If 'we' can, please flag as off-topic all the posts (or even entire threads) that we consider negative or too much on that topic, we want of course a friendly and in-topic forum, that serves it's purpose
Mentions: @jfbourdeau@stoppy98 .... if you have a bit of time, please flag / remove these posts to have a cleaned up better forum, I have big internet difficulties here and also trying to move to an 'easier' country, which is almost an adventure to do lol
My concern was more like about "it is good to have a message like this? or it worse, giving a bad feeling, to those (the big majority) that has no problem with that?"
What im searching is a correct way to, when downloading, communicate something like:
"we are offering Elive entirely cost-free even if we don't have the obligation to, and sadly we need to use delayed downloads (or similar) in order to keep this project alive, which is of course better than not having it at all, but please, If you don't like it just use another OS, nobody forces you to use Elive and to claim or exige anything just makes no sense"
This is of course a long text which nobody would read, the actual page shows a clear and simple system to download (which remembers to fast-share, which is good only in the sense that is easy to understand, but the overall feeling is a annoying download experience)
Well, there's nothing wrong with that , im in fact planning to make a special version (vanilla 3.0) only for privileged-like users (just the ones that likes elive, not about an economical/donation purpose), this would have multiple benefits which are described in a different thread
That's true, there will be always people complaining (about everything in this world), and they are a so small % amount that should be not considered (we could call it average normality)
This thread was more like focused about how to improve the feeling of that download page (in the case this method needs to be used), visually speaking, text used, process, etc...
so you want all this posts in this thread removed ? ( discussion between you and Lupuse is interesting but I also think we need to keep the forum positive)... SO GO ' hide those posts ? Anyway I will do it LOL
@yoda lol no, sorry, I wrote it wrong, i meant all the posts and threads of the whole forum, that has a negative, off-topic, or even not useful topic, like all the ones about the discussions of the “complaining” topics which we all are tired of
What is the benefit of Elive? That are the reasons, why the new users should wait or donate. But they don’t know.
The 3 times less Downloads are separated in groups.
lead - first timer, sees the screenshots, read about Elive
interest - sees Elive, has worked with enlightenment before, problems can be solved with FAQ
user - comes with basics from Elive 2.x
advanced user - using Elive with some productive programs
power user - want customization
supporter - donation or contribution to the project
I go to any car salespoint. I need a sporty car with a lot of space and it shouldn’t be so thirsty. The bad salesman sees no profit, the average salesman will recommend any car and the the good salesman explains why these points together are not realistic.
But if I just want the information, I don’t have the time for the good salesman. You don’t know me, I am already drove some cars and of course I know the benefits of the Tesla Roadstar, Tesla S and Tesla X. I’d just want the Tesla RoadstarSX, simple. Back to topic:
lead - What is Elive? 2 or 3? Wait to try a product I don’t now? Maybe.
interest - I’ve tested/seen Elive2 and It doesn’t suits me, I want to try Elive3. Wait 24h? Are you crazy?
user - I already drove Elive2, I know the benefits and want to go on with Elive3. Okay, than I’l upgrade tomorrow.
power/advanced user - I am using Elive2 on one or more systems, I am comfortable and want to go further. Okay, I could wait or maybe donate, because than there will be an Elive4
Result: The people who are most likely complainers, are not the most likely donators.
Actually the website has a good amount of structured characteristics in text, but it stills lack a good "visual presentation" and a "features showing", (this is of course a next thing to do)
So I assume that this point will be accomplished by presenting it correctly in the website, in other words "It has been not tried yet, but we can see all the good things that it includes"
I liked the Tesla's examples, but I think that I don't get the point with this example
That's a very good point
After to re-read again all the breakdowns, I think that all these details can be solved with a better website, which as said before, will: show elive more visually listing all its unique features
Ah, the Tesla example … The reason of missing the point is: the point is in a deleted part of the text
Short: People don’t know what they need, so they want everything, and hoping the right needs are within.
I am a huge fan of every kind of visualization, but I haven’t any viz-skills beside Excel Charts
So animated gif or short 10 seconds videos to show the top 10 or top 20 WOW hidden features in Elive
Either one video that show what you / consider to bee cool ? Or several small short videos for each wow effects ?
If a guys does the best hamburger on the planet, in his basement, people won’t know about him… So if Elive WOW features are hidden and can’t be easily experienced or seen, some videos will correct that…
Every one depends of which things are wanted to show, in order to find the optimal way to "present" it
Actually my idea is to create multiple Features (menu) web pages showing specific features, then, add a short-line description of that page in the main home-page. This way, will be very useful for the users to find what they are looking for, and also very good for the SEO (they will be like articles that can appear on internet)
Exactly , this is the purpose of the good presentation (which started since the template was changed, but the website still looks incomplete, there's a copy of the old one:
, im in fact planning to make a special version (vanilla 3.0) only for privileged-like users (just the ones that likes elive, not about an economical/donation purpose), this would have multiple benefits which are described in a different thread
